Seems odd to me - Dustin Pedroia A.L. MVP. How did that happen? I understand he's scrappy and and a great gold glove team player, but MVP? I thought the selection of Rollins two years ago watered down the selection standards, but Pedroia - Wow.

Well, I guess the standards are now flexible enough to shift away from power and rbi - and into heart and soul, and grit - with a player contributing at many levels but not necessarily requiring overwhelming stats in any capacity for the most part. Well he hit .326, and a whopping 54 doubles, but that alone is not historical MVP standard.

But if Pedroia, why not Youkilis? Same great attitude and team player, but with better power and production by far.

Youkilis: 29/115/.312/.390/.569/91 runs/43 doubles/
4 triples/168 hits in 538 AB's/K's 108/BB 62/SB 3. Late and Close: .272 BA/
2 Outs RISP:.328 BA/RISP .374 BA.

Pedroia:

17/83/.326/.376/.493/118 runs/54 doubles/
2 triples/175 hits Woops - 213 in 653 AB's/K's 52/BB 50/
SB 20. Late and Close: .368 BA/
2 Outs RISP: .231 BA/RISP .307 BA.

At the least let this be an inspiration to Reyes - If Dustin can do it, so could Jose who is more talented.

Quite frankly, Dustin's achievement serves notice to every position player starter - that MVP is attainable if one applies himself each and every game.

Makes me wonder if this will inspire more players to apply themselves. Will we see an uptick in consistent all around effort across the majors? Here's a second year player winning MVP. Think of all of today's great players who never once achieved that. What now are they thinking? Don't you just know what David Wright is thinking. First the Phils win the W.S. when Mets had capacity to do same, and now a second year player, MVP when David is talented enough by far to become MVP as well.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Tolerance,

Hey tol I responded to heilman see heilman wants to start or trade. it said that warthen and Manual would consider.Was not sure how to give you the spot so I just copied the short cut him.http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081120&content_id=3685938&vkey=hotstove2008&fext=.jsp

what it tells me is that it is not all about numbers. i know david wright is a very good player and you can write him down for 30hrs/120 rbi's every year. the thing is i do not think he has intangables like the other players you sighted. in my opinion, he is a horrible clutch player and when voting for the mvp, they take those attributes into account. now i don't understand how pujois beat out howard since howard was the reason the philies won.

That is a very good point and your right why not youk his batting with 2 outs and risp is even better I wonder if the rbi's made the difference

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty1:
Hey tol I responded to heilman see heilman wants to start or trade. it said that warthen and Manual would consider.Was not sure how to give you the spot so I just copied the short cut him.http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081120&content_id=3685938&vkey=hotstove2008&fext=.jsp

Hey Rusty, thanks a lot - I really appreciate that! I will check that out. I'm really excited to know he may have a chance.

Reyes has already put up a similar year to Pedroia's 2008. In 06, Reyes hit 300 with 19 HRs 81 RBI's over 120 runs scored, 30 doubles, 17 triples, 60 SB's.

Reyes finished 7th in MVP voting that season.

The problem with Reyes winning it is that the NL has Pujols, Howard, Berkman, and a ton of sluggers including 3 MVP candidates on his own team that will steal votes.

The AL for some reason does not have the same amount of MVP type candidates that put up those NL numbers.

quote:

howard was the reason the philies won

I know Howard had great numbers but I don't believe that the Phillies won because of him. they won because they played srappy and hard and when they needed a lift Victorino caried them for a while towards the end of the season. they simply played as a team injured and everything Utley is having hip surgery. He was playing with a problem hip feliz is having surgery too and no one realy new. they just battled. That is what I mean. and that took away from Howards numbers. And guess what if the mets had won 10 of the 30 blown saves those players would not have even finished the season so the mets even inspired them to play through their injuries. Puljols is just a bad dude he does it every year

i agree the phillies have a lot of scrappy players and they were a big part of their winning. however, the september numbers howard put i feel was a huge reason why they won. that last week, he was on a tear while david wright had a hard time getting the ball out of the infield.

quote:

Originally posted by tom041:
what it tells me is that it is not all about numbers. i know david wright is a very good player and you can write him down for 30hrs/120 rbi's every year. the thing is i do not think he has intangables like the other players you sighted. in my opinion, he is a horrible clutch player and when voting for the mvp, they take those attributes into account. now i don't understand how pujois beat out howard since howard was the reason the philies won.

Wright wasn't clutch in 2008 but he's had some really good numbers for his career. He needs to step it up from home to first and elevate his game.

As far as Pujols, I'm surprised it didn't go to Howard - and happy about that. Howard propelled the Phils and he had an insane power, clutch stretch and ton of rbi, but I guess voters couldn't see giving MVP to someone with .251 BA and far lower for almost all season Pujols had another terrific year, but strangely, never seemed newsworthy in 2008.

The biggest stat that shows why Youkilis should of won over Pedroia to me is 2 outs RISP.

Pedroia: .231
Youkilis: .328

Almost 100 points difference. I understand Pedroia isn't a big RBI guy but to me the MVP has to do more in a big spot with 2 outs.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty1:
That is a very good point and your right why not youk his batting with 2 outs and risp is even better I wonder if the rbi's made the difference

Rusty, I don't know why Dustin was chosen over Youk - Youk would have been my choice.

I wonder how much exposure voters have to actually see these players play on regular basis. Perhaps Dustin is player whose value grows the more one sees. Youk too. Perhaps the difference came down to speed and more athleticism. I wish I knew.

quote:

Originally posted by Tolerance:

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty1:
That is a very good point and your right why not youk his batting with 2 outs and risp is even better I wonder if the rbi's made the difference

Rusty, I don't know why Dustin was chosen over Youk - Youk would have been my choice.

I wonder how much exposure voters have to actually see these players play on regular basis. Perhaps Dustin is player whose value grows the more one sees. Youk too. Perhaps the difference came down to speed and more athleticism. I wish I knew.

Being in Boston for college I've seen a lot of Red Sox post games shows and interviews and stuff like that. Pedroia is a really like able player, both because of the way he plays the game and his personality. Youkilis plays the game the right way, but he is extremely vulgar, isn't very friendly and is overall just kind of a jerk. I don't know if this had anything to do with the decision but its worth mentioning.

quote:

Originally posted by WrightNReyes:
Reyes has already put up a similar year to Pedroia's 2008. In 06, Reyes hit 300 with 19 HRs 81 RBI's over 120 runs scored, 30 doubles, 17 triples, 60 SB's.

Reyes finished 7th in MVP voting that season.

The problem with Reyes winning it is that the NL has Pujols, Howard, Berkman, and a ton of sluggers including 3 MVP candidates on his own team that will steal votes.

The AL for some reason does not have the same amount of MVP type candidates that put up those NL numbers.

Yes, that's true. Strange, but true. Good point. The big boppers are now stacked in the NL. Youk and Morneau were in the chase, and Josh Hamilton didn't play on contender neither did Miquel Cabrera who started slow and finished with 37 homers and 127 rbi. There's also Arod, and Carlos Quentin but basically there's a tougher race in the NL.

quote:

Originally posted by LoDuca16:

quote:

Originally posted by Tolerance:

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty1:
That is a very good point and your right why not youk his batting with 2 outs and risp is even better I wonder if the rbi's made the difference

Rusty, I don't know why Dustin was chosen over Youk - Youk would have been my choice.

I wonder how much exposure voters have to actually see these players play on regular basis. Perhaps Dustin is player whose value grows the more one sees. Youk too. Perhaps the difference came down to speed and more athleticism. I wish I knew.

Being in Boston for college I've seen a lot of Red Sox post games shows and interviews and stuff like that. Pedroia is a really like able player, both because of the way he plays the game and his personality. Youkilis plays the game the right way, but he is extremely vulgar, isn't very friendly and is overall just kind of a jerk. I don't know if this had anything to do with the decision but its worth mentioning.

I think for some, personality might matter or be a difference maker in a close race. I didn't know that Youk is vulgar. Isn't he well liked?

In any case, I'm beginning to understand why Pedroia was chosen. I initially wrote he has 175 hits, when really it was 213 - best in majors. 175 hits was dividing point I read somewhere a few days ago that was comparing what he accomplished across a range of stats that few had ever achieved.

He also led the league in runs scored. Second in BA.

quote:

Originally posted by Tolerance:

quote:

Originally posted by tom041:
what it tells me is that it is not all about numbers. i know david wright is a very good player and you can write him down for 30hrs/120 rbi's every year. the thing is i do not think he has intangables like the other players you sighted. in my opinion, he is a horrible clutch player and when voting for the mvp, they take those attributes into account. now i don't understand how pujois beat out howard since howard was the reason the philies won.

Wright wasn't clutch in 2008 but he's had some really good numbers for his career. He needs to step it up from home to first and elevate his game.

As far as Pujols, I'm surprised it didn't go to Howard - and happy about that. Howard propelled the Phils and he had an insane power, clutch stretch and ton of rbi, but I guess voters couldn't see giving MVP to someone with .251 BA and far lower for almost all season Pujols had another terrific year, but strangely, never seemed newsworthy in 2008.

David aside from his talent is a most determined individual and dedicated athlete. I have a hunch he eventually will do a 180 and will be remembered as one of the best clutch hitters of his time when all is said and done. I am usually not in the prediction business,but this one time I will say "mark my words!"